LittleFoot Elegance Photo > Off-Topic Discussion

Requirements for an up to date trackings system

(1/3) > >>

Astroquattro:
Hi,

This thread will contain a list of requirements for a new tracking system based on open_hardware and the software written with languages that provide multiplattform support like python3x, QT, Firmata etc.

So please enter your thoughts below.

I will edit this post to have the actual list stored as first post.

the_lizardking:
for me important is a two star or three star alignemnt to make the goto better, as well as an encoder support goto and pec. Encoder synchronisation should be automatic and should support the system. Also important is a Polar Alignment function and a King Rate based on the actual position of the scope, for those who are mobile. GoTo of course should be standard these days as well as an modern not only 4 Keys handpad with a nice color display allowing to use guiding direct over it like the MGen technologie. Also important from my point of view is the robo focus, which should also allow as now to activate some features like roof controll and heater controll - filterwheel is not state of the art anymore because most filterwheels are running USB already. Not for me but maybe for others should be a camera controll for EOS & Co as well as the USB connector for the guiding cameras which should work with all possible QHY cameras on the market.
Also skip this shity RS232 and make a real USB connection! - LAN is not as that important from my point as there are many USB LAN Hubs on the market meanwhile but could be.

Think thats the beginning of the wishlist to santa clause,... hope many will follow!

Admin: Maybe we could make a separate group for it... für jene die nur Deutsch sprechen, tragt hier ein was Ihr von einer neuen modernen Steuerung erwarten würdet, damit wir endlich mal wieder in Gänge kommen - wenn wir weiter warten wird nix mehr daraus.

Armando:
Hi Christian,

what I would suggest now is to overcome the outdated FIXED guiding speeds...
Calibration could be made as always (at fixed guiding speed) but then the controller should be able to switch to PID mode. The MCU should compute (according to the guiding pulse duration) the corresponding tracking error and manage it by its own to be as quicker as possible...

CS
Armando

Astroquattro:

--- Quote from: the_lizardking on Wednesday, 18.09.13 - 18:06:01 - CEST ---for me important is a two star or three star alignemnt to make the goto better, as well as an encoder support goto and pec.

--- End quote ---
Why on earth woudl we need that? Didn't we want to build something from the 21th century? No goto! No pec! But encoders for precision and nanogyro based inertial systems which will provide the position of the telescope. Second, at December this year polaris will be about 40' away from the pole and those people who have a polar finder should at first get a new alignment plate. Third, if you know the concepts of hour angle and siderial time and don't move you mount around to much, having to change the latitude, one does not need a two to three star alignment like Scheiner, because it kills time one does not have. GPS pimped with GSM signals from the nearby cell towers provide a correct position within 1 to 3 cm. Most errors will be based on how you plant your scope and how good your balancing is.


--- Quote ---Encoder synchronisation should be automatic and should support the system. Also important is a Polar Alignment function and a King Rate based on the actual position of the scope, for those who are mobile. GoTo of course should be standard these days
--- End quote ---
What's GoTo for you? I have the feeling that you don't know what's meant by that in the first place, like most of the amateurs.


--- Quote ---as well as an modern not only 4 Keys handpad

--- End quote ---
Four keys will do if an extra handpad is needed at all. I was thinking of supporting smartphones for that. If you read the other thread, it's written there, that all maybe controlled by an android tablet, so you don't need all that. Once again, let's do that like nowadays not like thirty years ago.


--- Quote --- with a nice color display

--- End quote ---
Are we going to build a video gaming console? Do you know how much light such a display produces and how much energy it will consume?
Have you ever observed seriously?

--- Quote --- allowing to use guiding direct over it like the MGen technologie.

--- Quote --- How will you do guiding if you do not have a computer to do the image reduction for you? Read the line about the guiding systems in the other thread. Again, we want precision!


--- Quote --- Also important from my point of view is the robo focus

--- End quote ---
Good point! If one likes to use an electrified focuser, we should support it and we should have some tutorial about how to build one.


--- Quote --- which should also allow as now to activate some features like roof controll and heater controll

--- End quote ---
What has that to do with a tracking control?


--- Quote --- - filterwheel is not state of the art anymore because most filterwheels are running USB already.

--- End quote ---
Filter wheels do also not belong to tracking systems. But you're right, if one has a usb version it mostly is controllable by software like Maxim DL which is some kind of a standard.


--- Quote --- Not for me but maybe for others should be a camera controll for EOS & Co as well as the USB connector for the guiding cameras which should work with all possible QHY cameras on the market.

--- End quote ---
Nope again, that should not be part of a tracking control system. Cameras are controlled elsewhere not within the tracking control. That's why we do not build any stand-alone system! Read the other thread why.


--- Quote ---Also skip this shity RS232 and make a real USB connection!

--- End quote ---
You don't know much about computer, do you? Do you know what USB stands for and what RS232 is? USB stands for universal SERIAL bus. RS232 is SERIAL. Internally the signal transportation is the same just how the signals get convoluted differs and speeds up the transfer rates. Since we're talking about having Arduino as a basis, USB is included, even the Arduino ethernet has it's USB port, because the programming is done with it.


--- Quote --- - LAN is not as that important from my point as there are many USB LAN Hubs on the market meanwhile but could be.

--- End quote ---
Ethernet will be provided for a good reason. If one wants to use the tracking system in a robotic telescope ethernet is the connections to choose. Wlan is an option but has problems with cold and is not as save as cables. Wlan should be included if one builds the module to use it on a tablet and a smartphone as handpad.


--- Quote ---Think thats the beginning of the wishlist to santa clause,... hope many will follow!

Admin: Maybe we could make a separate group for it... für jene die nur Deutsch sprechen, tragt hier ein was Ihr von einer neuen modernen Steuerung erwarten würdet, damit wir endlich mal wieder in Gänge kommen - wenn wir weiter warten wird nix mehr daraus.

--- End quote ---

Wäre gut das mit der eigenen Gruppe! Aber jene die nur Deutsch sprechen habe so oder so ein Problem und seit man sich irgendwie darauf geeinigt hat als Amtssprache Englisch zu nehmen sollte dies doch auch gemacht werden.

cheers,
Christian
--- End quote ---

--- End quote ---

Astroquattro:

--- Quote from: Armando on Wednesday, 18.09.13 - 18:36:43 - CEST ---Hi Christian,

what I would suggest now is to overcome the outdated FIXED guiding speeds...
Calibration could be made as always (at fixed guiding speed) but then the controller should be able to switch to PID mode. The MCU should compute (according to the guiding pulse duration) the corresponding tracking error and manage it by its own to be as quicker as possible...

CS
Armando

--- End quote ---

As will have aut guiding there won't be any fixed guiding speeds but there will be accurate tracking based on siderial time where 1 second is equal to 997,269541667 milliseconds and not to 1000 which an MCU isn't capable off, too.
What's you definition of PID in this context? As we use auto guiding and a computer instead of a stand-alone version, we will be better, faster, more precise... as possible as physics laws allow. That is the point, we have to use a CPU NOT a MCU.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page